Fire Engines Photos

That's One Hell of a 4X4 Front Line Truck...
Compared With Cleveland's 4X4 Unimog!

Added by Dave Todd on 17 January 2014.

Agreed Dave. Would that more UK brigades would make this investment. These are the best of the best in my opinion. One of the most adaptable vehicles around with very unique performance.

Added by John Stott on 18 January 2014.

I've Worked with a Company that had an 1960-1970's Small Compacted One.. it wasn't a Appliance but It worked it's Nut's Off and is still around now as a fleet vehicle for another company in the North East.. not bad for coming up 50..

Added by Dave Todd on 19 January 2014.

All,
Problem is that Unimog chassis's are not cheap.
In these days of tight budgets some brigades are buying less expensive 4x4 vehicles and finding that when they enter service they don't perform too well.
Regards,
Steve

Added by Steve Prosser on 20 January 2014.

Steve - agreed as to the initial cost. But their durability makes the overall cost of ownership about the same as cheaper alternatives, because they do last a very long time, even in extreme duty conditions.

The BMPM in Marseille France operate more than 40 Unimogs, and they have a choice of both locally manufactured Renaults as well as MANs, which are also used by French brigades. The reasons are that they will go places the other brands won't, they are totally reliable, and they ultimately cost no more to operate over their service life, which is often 50% longer. In addition, they command a very good price as used trucks - particularly because North African fire services fight over buying them when they are ready to be sold off.

I have driven them on several different extreme off-road test circuits, and they do in fact defeat every other non-military 4X4 I have ever come across in the same weight categories. The two axle comes in various sizes{ the largest one accommodes a five person crew, 4000 liters of water, up to a 3000 LPM pump. CAFS, hose reels, a roof or bumper monitor, and a decent amount of locker space. The slightly longer 6X6 offers the same capacities, with the addition of a 7000 liter water tank.

Added by Rob Johnson on 20 January 2014.

I agree with Rob. Short term economies are fine. You have only to scan the comments on this site to see many commentators do not appreciate quality. Long term investment has been replaced with cheap and cheerful, with a few exceptions.
Did Dyce have to replace Cobras on a 2009 plate for Rosies? No the Cobras were good for many years. Carps also spring to mind. Reinventing the wheel is a pointless exercise unless it can be proven to be of use. Then fleet managers and senior officers think image projection more important it seems, remember the Sussex "white roof" debate? I think the figure was £10, 000 per appliance.
I worked with very ancient kit over the years, it usually worked very well, had built in reliability if serviced properly.
So, invest in quality, it pays long term.

Added by John Stott on 21 January 2014.

I also agree with Rob and just wanted to add that refurbishment becomes more popular in certain countries and due to their durability Unimogs are prime suspects for that process. With a "second life" added that way also the chassis cost appears in a different light.

Added by Martin Siegel on 21 January 2014.

There are a lot of great Unimog photos on this site, including some very old units still in service, as well as the modern ones including the 6X6.

Added by Rob Johnson on 21 January 2014.

All,
I am pleased that my posting has generated some comments. Before retirement I worked for a government department (as an experienced engineer) and was often overruled on procurement issues as the contract administrators would almost always go for the lowest bid.

I clearly remember writing, what I believed was a compelling and well argued case for not choosing the lowest bidder but my advice was ignored. Within weeks of being given the work the chosen contractor failed to meet the technical and delivery aspects of the contract. I got little satisfaction from the fact that I was proved correct and was very frustrated at what I considered was a waste of public funds.

Local government officers and procurement staff in the NHS also have a tendency to chose the lowest bidder, even when a engineer or someone with experience advises against such action. But such is life when public funds are under great pressure, and the well worn phrase "Value for Money" is quoted too often.

By the way I agree with all the comments regarding the suitability of Unimogs, particularly if whole life costs are taken into account at the procurement stage of the process.

Regards,
Steve

Added by Steve Prosser on 21 January 2014.

I think the first 'Mog' to be used in the Uk will be the Manchester Airport Fire Brigade's Foam/Rescue Tender which was new in about 1958ish..It has been 'resting' in the North West Museum of Transport for many years and is owned by an old friend of mine. Photos are on this site

Added by Barrie Green on 21 January 2014.

With regards to buying cheap and cheerful instead if the more expensive but durable options. I wish the UK would look at the German rural brigades. Why do you think they are still using the old Mercedes appliances and haven't replaced appliances in nearly 30 years? Because they are reliable and still work amazingly well! This is proof that it's better to buy things that last!

Added by Joel Whitaker on 18 April 2014.

Joel,
I just read of a fire dept here in Austria that had their 1984 Unimog refurbished (complete fire fighting bodywork and fire fighting equipment. They expect the truck to last another 20-25 years.
Amazing quality the Unimog, especially when you know that this one doubled as a snow plough until 2012.
Reason why so many fire depts. here in Austria as well as in Germany have equipment that old is that they won't get new one earlier. Usual replacement time here in my region is 28 years (voluntary fire depts.)

Added by Martin Siegel on 18 April 2014.

We had dennis that lasted for many years with utmost reliability but we chose to buy lorries instead, what happened was we lost dennis , yet irish amd new zealand brigade cannot get enough of them and give them a second life of many many years , there is a dennis f7 in comments with hull fire brigade that in 1967 was still in front lin eservice , when I was a younger well much younger fireman as I was called then 15-20 years was the service life of an appliance and then sent down the line to retained yet now its 10-13 average over all some less , cannot possibly be because they are not fit for purpose , be interested to hear why , the basic appliance hasnt changed much except for size its pretty much the same as it was 30 years ago , body with lockers , cab with seats and b/a and ladders on roof , pump at back , longer to accommodate extra kit but basically the same , why do we waste money when we are always told there is none , bremach is a case in point when talking 4x4 , pinz and landrover are big enough for by far the most uses and unimog for heavy duty only , its a bit big and expensive (very very) for 99% of uses but when you need this machine its the only one to use

Added by Donny on 19 April 2014.

Yes joel and we gave away or sold fleets of perfectly good reliable dennis sabres and rapiers whilst still only half way through thier lives for more fashionable and in most ways a retrograde step continental truck based chassis , shamefull

Added by Alan on 21 April 2014.

It seems brigade purchased to replace sabres and rapiers just for 'image' purposes. Shameful

Added by Joel Whitaker on 22 April 2014.

Was this because the appliances were leased? It seems that leasing fire appliances is (or was) a popular alternative to buying in the UK. This looks on the surface like a less costly choice. But it means that the leasing companies need to get the units back while they are still new enough to be attractive as resale vehicles.

Added by Rob Johnson on 23 April 2014.

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